the first one between cheney and lieberm lieberman -- joining me -- he joins me from san francisco traveling out there, i'm guessing for fundraising purposes. >> i'm not chair of the dga anymore. that's governor o'malley. >> thank you very much. of course it is. my mistake on that. >> governor let me start with how good is this vice presidential debate to the obama campaign? >> i think it's an important debate to the campaign, it's an important debate to the country, and i think it's a great opportunity for vice president biden to support policy -- the real difference here is that vice president biden will support the policies that he has always supported and what we saw is that last week governor romney didn't and i'm looking forward to the vice president showing that. >> do you think the vice president has to be more aggressive than president obama was? >> i do. and the president has acknowledged that himself. but i think in the end, the opinions of the candidates are really cumulative, and fortunately so much of it comes down to the actual substance of the ideas. >> if you were giving adv